Author Topic: Modified zig-zag approach to off-season diet.  (Read 3434 times)

Online ljimd

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Modified zig-zag approach to off-season diet.
« on: December 28, 2012, 10:05:35 AM »
The following is just my personal experiment. I have no idea if it would work
for anyone else or if indeed it will work on a long term basis. It is just my attempt
to fit what I've learned into my goals and lifestyle.

Goals: re-establish an accurate maintenance calorie level
       make my diet more socially/friendly (beer, forbidden foods or social events)
       determine whether I could gain mass on maintenance or lose bf?
       stay reasonably close(within 2%) to competition b/f levels 9/11% (I used
       http://www.weightrainer.net/circbf.html as a rough guide)



I used the site below to calculate daily cals.

http://www.iifym.com/tdee-calculator


Activities per day in MINUTES (24h = 1440 min)
Minutes left to distribute: 0
Sleeping:    480   mins    
Very light:    940   mins    Reading, Sitting, Driving, Eating, Chatting, WatchingTV
Light:        20       mins    Walking, Cleaning, Cooking, Slow bicycling
Moderate:      0   mins    Fast walking, Carrying bags, Sex
Heavy Moderate:   0      mins    Swiming, Running, Basketball, Fast bicycling, Workingout
Very heavy:      0   mins    Boxing, Heavy workout
      
Based on your information your details, the TDEE calculator puts your daily calorie
requirement at 1908


Activities per day in MINUTES (24h = 1440 min)
Minutes left to distribute: 0
Sleeping:     480   mins    
Very light:     865   mins    Reading, Sitting, Driving, Eating, Chatting, WatchingTV
Light:         20    mins    Walking, Cleaning, Cooking, Slow bicycling
Moderate:       mins    Fast walking, Carrying bags, Sex
Heavy Moderate:   75      mins    Swiming, Running, Basketball, Fast bicycling, Workingout
Very heavy:       0   mins    Boxing, Heavy workout
      

Based on your information your details, the TDEE calculator puts your daily calorie
requirement at 2435


The diet: My approach was to run 5 days/wk at a slight deficit(@1900) and 2 days (Fri+Sat)
at surplus (@2500) for a weekly total of @14500 cals (@2071day). My goal was .5gr fat per #
bwt and 1+ gr protein per #bwt, the rest carbs. The 79 day average was: 2105. Alcohol intake
averaged 5 cans/wk. Spiked coffee 1.5 shots/wk. These alcohol cals skewed the figures just
a tad. Results of weekly averages: F-90gr, C-120/130gr, P-168/180. I drank at least 1 gallon
of liquid a day minimum - primarily water, coffee and beer. Only supps were whey protein
and a multivitamin. 6 fish oil tabs. No HRT. That's it.

Training: Completed (3) 4-week mini cycles (4 training days/wk) ramping weights to 5 rep maxes for 3 consecutive weeks and then a deload at 80% of finish of previous cycle. Strength increased each week but felt drained by the time I reached my calorie surplus day (usually Fri). I don't expect this linear progress to continue  much longer, but I'll see.

Checking:  I used Casey Butt's calculator at Weightrainer, a tape and scale to measure
changes. During the 79 days bwt fluctuated from a low of 157.8# to 164#. The 79 day Average was
160.69#


Weightrainer:

Oct 10


The WeighTrainer
Bodyfat/Lean Body Mass Calculator

Gender:   male   Weight:   160.8 lbs
Height:   68 in    Waist:   30 in
Iliac:   31 in
Hips:   36 in

Your estimated body fat percentage is: 10.7 %

Your estimated lean body mass is: 143.7 lbs


Dec 28

The WeighTrainer
Bodyfat/Lean Body Mass Calculator

Gender:   male   Weight:   160.4 lbs
Height:   68 in    Waist:   29.5 in
Iliac:   30.5 in
Hips:   35.5 in

Your estimated body fat percentage is: 9.4 %

Your estimated lean body mass is: 145.3 lbs

Observations:

Like I stated above, I wanted to do some monitoring to see what would happen if I trained
heavy(for me at 65yo) at maintenance calories with what I considered a reasonable macro
breakdown.

Results - could I stay within reasonable precontest shape(within 2%((8%comp goal)) bodyfat and 4/8# bwt)
while maintaining or even gaining lbm and dropping some bf? Yes. Even though the
changes are small, they are moving in the right direction.

In the past I used a "seat of the pants" approach to off-season training/diet, followed by
8-12 weeks of the madness of pre-contest (or whatever goal). I've changed my mind and will use a
much more measured approach.

Just thought I would share. Thanks for reading.

Online induced_drag

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Re: Modified zig-zag approach to off-season diet.
« Reply #1 on: December 28, 2012, 11:03:03 AM »
Very cool!

I like the Zig-zag approach.

It is very similar to carb cycling in that the caloric amounts change daily.  I have had very good success carb cycling.  Did your difference in calories come mainly in the form of carbs and alcohol?


Online ljimd

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Re: Modified zig-zag approach to off-season diet.
« Reply #2 on: December 28, 2012, 11:05:33 AM »
Very cool!

I like the Zig-zag approach.

It is very similar to carb cycling in that the caloric amounts change daily.  I have had very good success carb cycling.  Did your difference in calories come mainly in the form of carbs and alcohol?

Carbs -yes. Only as much alcohol as I could fit in. That in itself keep it lower.

Online Bando

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Re: Modified zig-zag approach to off-season diet.
« Reply #3 on: December 28, 2012, 11:22:35 AM »
65 year old competitive BB'er that fits beer into his macros

I like the cut of your jib!


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DIEL?

Online induced_drag

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Re: Modified zig-zag approach to off-season diet.
« Reply #4 on: December 28, 2012, 11:55:14 AM »
Very similar to my diet.   Only difference is I run 3 "higher" carb days (aprox at maint) and 4 days at a good deficit.

By doing this, I have never had to drop cals during cuts as I dont think I get the metabolic slow down associated with restricting cals.  (or at least not nearly as bad).

This has worked well for me.

Current macros and cals

MWF (workout days)
2613cal
290 carb
230 pro
60 fat

Tu, Thu, Sat, Sun
2212cal
190carb
230pro
60fat

Average daily cals over 7 days = 2400   (this puts me at about a 400cal deficit)




I actually do the same thing when "bulking".   I eat more carbs on WO days...and closer to maint on non wo days.

Works real well.   I ran a surplus for 5 months and picked up minimal body fat this way.

Online ljimd

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Re: Modified zig-zag approach to off-season diet.
« Reply #5 on: December 28, 2012, 12:31:44 PM »
65 year old competitive BB'er that fits beer into his macros

I like the cut of your jib!

Life is too short to spend your time as a dietary monk. There is always a way to enjoy
a few beers. Closer to a comp - not so much, but off season, no sweat.

Online ljimd

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Re: Modified zig-zag approach to off-season diet.
« Reply #6 on: December 28, 2012, 12:45:31 PM »
Very similar to my diet.   Only difference is I run 3 "higher" carb days (aprox at maint) and 4 days at a good deficit.

By doing this, I have never had to drop cals during cuts as I dont think I get the metabolic slow down associated with restricting cals.  (or at least not nearly as bad).

This has worked well for me.

Current macros and cals

MWF (workout days)
2613cal
290 carb
230 pro
60 fat

Tu, Thu, Sat, Sun
2212cal
190carb
230pro
60fat

Average daily cals over 7 days = 2400   (this puts me at about a 400cal deficit)




I actually do the same thing when "bulking".   I eat more carbs on WO days...and closer to maint on non wo days.

Works real well.   I ran a surplus for 5 months and picked up minimal body fat this way.


I run higher fat totals than you 80/90gr. Very seldom do I have a 200gr carb day. Seems to be
instant belly fat for me. I read age has some influence over it. (When I competed in the 80's/90's
I used high carb low fat to get lean - it was the info out there).



I wanted to add more carbs during my w/o days but just couldn't make it fit. So I said, hell with
it and trained on deficit. I would know one way or the other if energy/glycogen works on a
24 hour cycle. So far, for me it doesn't. Weekly is ok. Like I said - so far. I do get a little tired
on my last w/o of the week.

I love experimenting with this stuff as I know you do too. Glad we can share ideas.

Online induced_drag

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Re: Modified zig-zag approach to off-season diet.
« Reply #7 on: December 28, 2012, 02:16:30 PM »
If you are feeling run down in the latter week workouts, try MCT oil.   I just began bringing it in pre-wo and it is helping a TON with energy.

I take 1tbs about 45min pre-workout.   Your body uses it like a carb and it goes to instant energy.   No insulin response though.   It has been around forever, but I just am now trying it and loving it!

Online ljimd

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Re: Modified zig-zag approach to off-season diet.
« Reply #8 on: May 10, 2013, 07:25:35 AM »
Update:

I've continued this zig-zag diet approach with one exception - I increased my original
daily maintenance cals by 100/200 cals/day or @1000 a week to @15500 weekly.

Training has remained the same. Heavy as I can go, progressive cycles and have
experienced modest strength increases.

Again, I use the Weightrainer site because it's convenient and I'm more interested in
trends. I have no idea how accurate it is.

May 10 2013

The WeighTrainer
Bodyfat/Lean Body Mass Calculator

Gender:   male   Weight:   158.4 lbs
Height:   68 in    Waist:   29 in
Iliac:   31 in
Hips:   35 in

Your estimated body fat percentage is: 8.9 %

Your estimated lean body mass is: 144.3 lbs


This was Oct 10 2012

Oct 10


The WeighTrainer
Bodyfat/Lean Body Mass Calculator

Gender:   male   Weight:   160.8 lbs
Height:   68 in    Waist:   30 in
Iliac:   31 in
Hips:   36 in

Your estimated body fat percentage is: 10.7 %

Your estimated lean body mass is: 143.7 lbs


Not sure how to interpret the differences. Could be minor and the result of margin of
error (imprecise measuring technique, water retention/depletion etc).

The trend is mildly encouraging, ie b/f and LBM but painfully slow.

It could be that my entire experiment has taken place at a caloric level well below
what would ensure greater changes. Not sure.

I'm open to any opinions, discussions or observations.