Author Topic: Der Alta's "How many things wrong can you count?  (Read 1517 times)

Online AlexanderOmand

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A friend of mine recently posted a 315x15 squat set.  He's built like a garden gnome, but I've got a few pounds and a few years on him.  I figured I've give it a shot and see how I did.  I made 315x10. 

How many things can you count that I did wrong.  Please post them, as I'm looking to improve this next week.

315x10
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Offline Marius

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Re: Der Alta's "How many things wrong can you count?
« Reply #1 on: April 27, 2012, 09:26:57 AM »
I feel kind of funny giving you advice, but on the other hand, some of what I saw are the things I need to work on, too.

1. Your hips need to drop a little more. You're torso has too much forward lean on the descent. I know some is unavoidable with a low bar placement, but if you strengthen your abdominal wall, the tendency to fold will stop.

2. You're not controlling the weight enough in the descent, relying too much on the stretch reflex (maybe subconsciously?) that isn't as powerful as it would be if you controlled your descent more.

3. You're breaking your wrists almost as soon as you start to descend. This loosens the muscle contraction in the torso contributing in part to issue 1. Can you drive your elbows down while keeping your wrists locked? This helps me a lot in maintaining tension in my upper body.

4. This isn't wrong, but something I found that helps me control the weight more is if I drive my neck into the bar, tilt my head back, and roll my eyes toward the ceiling.

Hope this helps.
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Re: Der Alta's "How many things wrong can you count?
« Reply #2 on: April 27, 2012, 09:40:59 AM »
After your legs stop bending you lower the weight by leaning forward, then you start doing a partial 'good morning' to get the weight moving again before you start using your legs again.

How's your back feel?
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Online AlexanderOmand

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Re: Der Alta's "How many things wrong can you count?
« Reply #3 on: April 27, 2012, 01:37:58 PM »
Quote
I feel kind of funny giving you advice, but on the other hand, some of what I saw are the things I need to work on, too.
No worries, I am always looking for advice.  Something that I miss, others often see.

Quote
1. Your hips need to drop a little more. You're torso has too much forward lean on the descent. I know some is unavoidable with a low bar placement, but if you strengthen your abdominal wall, the tendency to fold will stop.
You're the second person that has noted I need to do Ab work.

Quote
2. You're not controlling the weight enough in the descent, relying too much on the stretch reflex (maybe subconsciously?) that isn't as powerful as it would be if you controlled your descent more.
My spotter picked up on that and pointed it out to me.  I was so busy concentrating on 15 reps, I didn't think about the rep I was doing.

Quote
3. You're breaking your wrists almost as soon as you start to descend. This loosens the muscle contraction in the torso contributing in part to issue 1. Can you drive your elbows down while keeping your wrists locked? This helps me a lot in maintaining tension in my upper body.
I've never picked up on that before.  Going back and reviewing old videos/pics, I did notice that my wrists almost always bent hidesouly.

Quote
4. This isn't wrong, but something I found that helps me control the weight more is if I drive my neck into the bar, tilt my head back, and roll my eyes toward the ceiling.
Thanks, that's all part of the technique I need to improve on.

Quote
After your legs stop bending you lower the weight by leaning forward, then you start doing a partial 'good morning' to get the weight moving again before you start using your legs again.

How's your back feel?
Due to my back being so much stronger, and my form being horrible, I subconciously drop the weight as low as possible.  Whereas I should be dropping my hips as low as possible, instead.  Unsuprisingly, my back is fine today.  Quads, though...

My ribs are a bit tender as well, but that was due to the leg press going deep enough that my quads hit my ribs.

Thanks guys, I'd like anyone else to chime in on this and other possible issues.

My spotter noted that I drop my left side slightly, and this forces my knees in.  He said had I been more aware of my form, I wouldn't have had that happen, and thus, would have made the 15 reps.
Do not fear The Iron, for it does not care.
The Iron is Resolute in Purpose, Steadfast in Intent, Unwavering in Desire, and Immovable in Stature.
Unless acted upon by a Superior Force.
Squat: 545; Bench: 350; Deadlift: 610; Total: 1490

Online AlexanderOmand

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Re: Der Alta's "How many things wrong can you count?
« Reply #4 on: May 04, 2012, 08:55:47 AM »
So... Lets have an update.

This weeks squat session was pressed for time, so I decided to concentrate on my form.

Here's a 315 for 6.  My depth wasn't there, but still decent.  It does look like the form is improving.
315lb for 6


Here a 365 single, that looked pretty good.
365lb squat


And a sloppy 405 to finish the night.
405 lb squat.


As I've watched the 405 a few times, I see my first mistake is where I'm looking.  Any other thoughts or improvements, you guys see?
Do not fear The Iron, for it does not care.
The Iron is Resolute in Purpose, Steadfast in Intent, Unwavering in Desire, and Immovable in Stature.
Unless acted upon by a Superior Force.
Squat: 545; Bench: 350; Deadlift: 610; Total: 1490

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Re: Der Alta's "How many things wrong can you count?
« Reply #5 on: May 04, 2012, 12:32:55 PM »
I'll check 'em out when I get home tomorrow
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Offline Marius

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Re: Der Alta's "How many things wrong can you count?
« Reply #6 on: May 04, 2012, 03:36:16 PM »
I didn't notice anything really bad in the 315 video, just a slight hip timing issue coming out of the pocket from the 2nd rep on, but overall, you looked really controlled and had good depth. Not perfect, but you're sure as hell outsquatting me. :)

At 365, shit, you're strong. (srs) A little bit of a sway when you're coming up, but not anything to worry about pushing that much relative weight.

405...fugeddaboudit. If you can get 405, any way you do it short of blowing your ass out is outstanding.
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Online AlexanderOmand

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Re: Der Alta's "How many things wrong can you count?
« Reply #7 on: May 04, 2012, 04:13:03 PM »
Such subtle nuances to this lift.  If you hadn't pointed it out, I never would have seen that Hip/Back timing issue.  Very minor deviation, but with heavier weight will create a big hiccup.  I suspect that's also the fault with the 405.  My hips move before my shoulders do, and cause that tip forward, which in turn means my back has to compensate for the difference.

Thanks!
Do not fear The Iron, for it does not care.
The Iron is Resolute in Purpose, Steadfast in Intent, Unwavering in Desire, and Immovable in Stature.
Unless acted upon by a Superior Force.
Squat: 545; Bench: 350; Deadlift: 610; Total: 1490

Online AlexanderOmand

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Re: Der Alta's "How many things wrong can you count?
« Reply #8 on: June 08, 2012, 11:01:00 AM »
Still having that same issue.  I think I'll have to use 365 as my working sets to eliminate that "tip forward" motion.

Another video of it from last night.



Sorry about the Fat Ass.  His nickname is "Heavy Duty", because he the absolute definition of Heavy weight, short ROM, big bragging".
Do not fear The Iron, for it does not care.
The Iron is Resolute in Purpose, Steadfast in Intent, Unwavering in Desire, and Immovable in Stature.
Unless acted upon by a Superior Force.
Squat: 545; Bench: 350; Deadlift: 610; Total: 1490

Offline Marius

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Re: Der Alta's "How many things wrong can you count?
« Reply #9 on: June 12, 2012, 02:23:15 PM »
I can see your body isn't moving with synergy under that much weight.

What kind of ab and lower back training do you do? That hip compensation usually happens because of a lack of abdominal strength or lower back strength. Are you doing good mornings regularly?
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Online AlexanderOmand

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Re: Der Alta's "How many things wrong can you count?
« Reply #10 on: June 12, 2012, 04:54:54 PM »
Lower Back training very good. Ab work, as previously noted, is where I'm lacking.  I've been making is a priority to train them much better and more consistent to solve that particular problem.

Thanks again for catching it.

I think my best approach is to stay below 315 and work on smoothing out the action.
Do not fear The Iron, for it does not care.
The Iron is Resolute in Purpose, Steadfast in Intent, Unwavering in Desire, and Immovable in Stature.
Unless acted upon by a Superior Force.
Squat: 545; Bench: 350; Deadlift: 610; Total: 1490

Offline Marius

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Re: Der Alta's "How many things wrong can you count?
« Reply #11 on: June 13, 2012, 02:29:59 PM »
There was something I was trying to formulate into a coherent thought that I'm having trouble articulating. It's about CNS grooving at ~60% of 1RM.

Does that ring any bells? It's something that I know that I know because I've used it. I just can't get the thought to come out in a coherent way.
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